On the Record: Charles County w/ Cheryl Butler Walker

In this episode host Carlos Childs is joined by Cheryl Butler-Walker candidate for Charles County Commissioner District 2 shares her extensive experience in community building, housing advocacy, and her vision for Charles County's development. She discusses accountability in development, infrastructure needs, and her plans to improve local governance and community well-being. Cheryl Butler-Walker discusses her candidacy, local governance issues, economic development, data centers, and community concerns in Charles County. She emphasizes transparency, smart growth, and community engagement.

Cheryl Butler Walker:

• Campaign website

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Transcript

SPEAKER_03 0:05

What's up, you all? What is up, you all? Welcome to Left Handed Leftists. You all, we have an amazing conversation, and you all, this is a YouTube exclusive conversation. It is one of our candidate conversations. I will be talking with a candidate for District 2 commissioner in Charles County. And we're gonna be talking about HOAs, we're gonna be talking about stormwater management, we're gonna be talking about data centers and the whole economic development, unhoused people. We're gonna talk about all the issues going on within District 2, the western part of Charles County. You all, I am so excited for this conversation, and I'm so excited for the just overall just push you all have been doing to bump up our YouTube page and our and our uh podcast platform as well. Please, please, please keep it up, you all. So before we get into the episode, I want to tell you all our guest today. Our guest is Cheryl Butler Walker. She is a candidate for District 2 commissioner here in Charles County. And right before we get into it, remember, please like, share, subscribe, hit that note, hit that like butt. Please remember to like, share, and subscribe to the podcast. Please rate us five stars. Please hit that notifications bell so you can get alerted every time a new episode comes out. And also do everything that you can to pump up our YouTube page, you all. We just uh went over a hundred and plus subscribers, so let's keep that number going and let's keep this podcast growing. And with that, you all, let's get into the episode. What's up, you all? What is up, you all? Cheryl Butler Walker in the building. How's it going today?

SPEAKER_01 1:44

It is fantastic. It is even better now that I'm on the podcast with a Carlos Childs. Life is good.

SPEAKER_03 1:52

Thank you, thank you, thank you. It's so glad to have you here, especially with everything going on today. And you all, you don't need to know all the behind-the-scenes stuff that went into us being on. I just again just want to thank thank you, Cheryl, for just sticking with me with all the technical issues and difficulties. And again, so glad to have you here to talk all about District 2 in Charles County today. So if you can go ahead and start us off by letting the viewers know who may or may not know you just who or who you are, what you're running for, and why.

SPEAKER_01 2:24

So I am Cheryl Butler Walker. I am running for District 2 commissioner. I am a 30, I'm a 25-year neighbor and friend, but I'm a 30-year veteran of community building. So for 30 years I've been in property management. Believe it or not, I see a lot of folks that um I manage their apartment community. And here I am today. Now I'm overseeing their HOAs or condos, wherever they live in the great state of Maryland. I am a staunch housing advocate, expert. I am known for those things. I believe in community. I understand infrastructure. I understand budgeting. I have to. But more importantly, I understand family and people. So for 30 years, I've watched some families have their first child and now be in a home in Beech Tree, right? I've um come into uh Charles County during the bubble and watched some families lose it all. Some people, some families manage to keep it, but even more so, I've seen the effect of it all on children. And some of that is what we're even seeing right now. So um it's been a journey, 30 years. I'm excited. Why am I here today? Because today is the moment. Now is the time, right? So having someone here for the very first time, very first time, a uh property manager with my level of experience, with my years and certifications, because I am a PCAM, those in HOA understand it. I'm a CPM, those in an apartment understand it. These are the two highest designations you can hold. And I'm also a broker, right? So I'm here for housing, I'm here for community, I'm here for what is right. I'm not bought. Let's get that out of the way right now because I don't need to be. I get up every day and I go to work. I work hard at what I do, and I believe this is what has allowed me to be um comfortably in this position to run and do it with integrity and assure the community that if I ever go behind a closed door, you don't have to worry about me being anybody else but who I am, because I don't have to be. That's my story, and I'm sticking to it.

SPEAKER_03 4:30

There you go, to the last day. I love it. I love it, I love it. Can you also tell people just what you're running for and also what made you run in Charles County for office?

SPEAKER_01 4:40

I'll tell you that many, many of your listeners may know then the delegate Joanne C. Benson. She's a powerhouse in Annapolis. When I was in in my younger 20s, in the 90s, she helped me appreciate the importance of the right political officials. How did she do it? At that time, I was uh managing a community in Landover, Kent Village apartments. And it was so terrible there. Like uh the businesses will pull down the gates at the end of the day. You could smell old fish being fried. It was terrible. And myself and the manager then, a competitor, but I don't believe in that. We're all friends. We all had the same objective, right? Uh his name was Leslie Taylor. Leslie was from Chicago. And he went to church with then delegate Joanne C. Denson. And I went over across the street and I was like, you know, Leslie, we really have to do something. This is not right. People shouldn't live here. And he was like, girl, I know the right one. We're gonna call old Miss Joanne. I wanna say maybe the next week, she was in Stratford Woods apartment. The three of us sat down. She gave us one charge. She said, if you want to change it, you all are gonna go out and you're gonna knock on every business door. You're gonna get me the name of every single uh management company out here. And I don't want to know the little people. You get me a vice president or hire. I want decision makers. Today, Carlos, that is the 202 coalition. It is the longest-standing coalition in the state of Maryland. And I'm so excited to say that I'm a co-founder with my good friend Leslie Taylor and now Senator Joanne C. Benson. And so I think the other person who affected me that I believe gave me what I needed to finally get here, was the first African-American county executive, Wayne C. Carey, who mentored me, who was clear with me, who understood what I was about, who challenged me for even how I wanted to give back to the community. How do I get political officials to want to do that, right? These two people have, in my opinion, groomed me for this position. They said that a political official doesn't have to be bought. They don't have to do what the developers say. They have to tell the developers what they're supposed to do, right? And then they get that direction from the people who voted them in. And so I think that right now in Charles County, with the lawsuit that has happened, with uh a community that I managed, where in the in the wintertime the streets are covered with ice when it rains or snow. They can't get out and they can't get to their mailbox because here in Charles County, someone didn't know how to conduct the business with the developers. And so I say to you, yeah, I'm running. I'm running for that. I'm running because getting a 40% uh recordation tax really sent me over the edge. Because budgeting 101 says you never lay flat, right? It's a little bit at a time. So no one is hit with that amount of money all at once. And so that did it. You know, I'm here. Uh, who do you call? Do you call your commission, your commissioner? Will they answer? So I'm running for all those regions. And the thing about it is, is that most people who are in an apartment or in a HOA or condo, they know me. And they know that Cheryl is gonna get it, get right into it. I'm the only person. Let me just give this last little bit so I can level us out here. I am the founder of the only builders' round table in the state of Maryland. When I put the builder's round table together, I did it for just the reasons Charles County is upset right now, right? No one's listening, no one's holding anyone accountable. I think home buyers sometimes, sometimes, sometimes can be upset with the wrong party in the agreement, right? Because the developer is going to build to whatever the county said I had to build to, yes? And if there was no one at the table who understood the importance of bonds, the importance of understanding grade, then we are where we are. So my hope is, is uh, as I said, in my opinion, I'm the most qualified person for this moment. If God says so, I've raised up to that, and then the rest is going to happen. So that's why I'm here.

SPEAKER_03 9:04

Thank you for that. You listen to some deep experience, which is which is always good to hear, especially because it's not coming just from, you know, the corporate sector side. It's coming from what sounds like actual grassroots advocacy work as well, which I find is so missing from the current commissioners and just politics in general. We get people who are so far removed from community, don't know who the community members are, who the power players are, or even the community not even knowing who their elected officials are. So it's definitely a breath of fresh air to hear that. And with what you said about housing, I mean, let's go ahead and dive right on into it. One of the things that we're seeing in district two, um, but but throughout the whole county is the increase of just developers slapping up homes left and right, no type of real accountability to them. It's people who got their house or got their house built or had their house built. It cost them over $500,000. And they are already seeing cracks and foundations, seeing problems with topsoil, seeing issues where where they have uh sinkholes and the stormwater management has gone awry and all this. And then developers are still saying, okay, changing uh, let us change some uh zoning so we're able to build more without fully even realizing what we're supposed to do with neighborhoods. I mean, neighborhoods getting turned over to the uh the residents before all the major stuff stuff is done, or they even build out the whole neighborhood like they um are supposed to. So I wanted to ask you first is what do you what what accountability measures would you bring or would you lead on bringing to the county when it comes to developers?

SPEAKER_01 10:37

I think the first thing that needs to happen is that an assessment needs to be in place of the county agency that oversees it, right? So if that's PGM, there needs to be an assessment of their knowledge of uh development and building. I think that um that is probably the beginning because understanding what they know uh and why they believe what they know is gonna be huge for me because we wouldn't have these issues. I'll say it again. We can all be upset with the developers if you built a home and the foundation has cracked. But guess what? When the foundation is dropped, county inspector is supposed to be there to inspect it. So this is not something that we are going to start from the beginning. We're going to go in and find out who is qualified to do it, right? Who's qualified to do it? The right conversations are being had. And I think that that is the beginning because that's the beginning everywhere. I'll tell you this. I'll tell you this. People uh in other counties right now are concerned, even prior to anything else, right? What is happening in different seats? People being qualified to be in the seat. If we're not doing that, then this doesn't stop. So who is that person, right? So it's the the easy way out is to say developer, developer, builder, builder, builder. Who didn't inspect? Who didn't know what to look for? Where did this where did the soil come from? Is it from another um uh development that was filled with rocks and we dropped it there and now we can't grow grass? All of those things are important. And I think having someone at the table that has a relationship with both sides, yes? So that we can hold them accountable because I want somebody to hold me accountable, right? So if you, if I'm saying this to everyone today that I know what I'm talking about, I've been doing it, I'm asking you for your vote because that is the skill set that I have. I have every expectation you're gonna hold me to it, because I have every expectation to tell you the truth. So if there are roadblocks before me, I would suggest if I win, we move those out of the way. Because there are two things that I'm clear on. No is not an answer for me unless I say, no, I don't want to have cocktails with you. No, I don't want to go to the movies with you. But no doesn't really work in my line of business. How is the word. Tell me how. Because that's the part we're missing here. It's the how. How do we make the change? Who do we go with to make that change? And when when we go with that person, what is their how? How are you gonna do it? What do you know and how can we align with what you're saying? I say to everybody who do your research, my website is crystal clear.

SPEAKER_03 13:14

I love that. I love that. I mean, even it's a famous quote by Jesse Jackson when he was uh running running his campaign for um president. He wanted to push out a policy and the and his campaign style saying, No, you can't do that. And he said, I didn't ask you if I can or can't. I said, How can I get it done? Because where there's a will, there's a way to do it. Whether it's policy needs to change, whether it's like we need to go to the state to get some enabling legislation, we can do it. And I'm so glad you that you said that because a lot of times you see politicians just stick with like if the county government said, no, we can't do that currently, oh, hey, we can't do it. Go home, pack it up. Y'all, we're done for the whole term and let it go. So so glad to hear you say that.

SPEAKER_01 13:55

You said something, Carlos, that I want to elaborate on. You said something about, you know, sometimes we go to Annapolis and uh we're hopeful for an answer. Well, we're under a government that requires us to get our answers when session is in. So when the General Assembly is there, that is where we get the, you know, what we need to have happen in Charles County to happen. Yes? I was in uh Annapolis, which I visit quite often just for what I do anyway. So I have a lot of friends there, and I feel like um those friendships are meaningful for me. I was there with the National Coalition of 100 Black Women, in which I am, and we were there doing a bill signing because this is the first time in state history that the Purple Lights bill is here. It is a bill that says no to domestic violence. We fought for that, we did that, we signed the bill this week. But I say this leading into while I was there, my conversation was not about the purple lights. It was talking to the delegates there that are in leadership over health to tell them I need a hospital in Indian Head. I need a hospital in Nanjamoy. You give me a patient first, please, on Brian's Road. This is what I was there saying. They said to me, okay, Cheryl, let's get together. I called my good friend Edith Perry, who is the chief of staff for the Speaker of the House, and we're going to have a meeting because this is unacceptable. And I want you to know that when I said that to them, everybody was like, I was like, exactly, while clutching my pearls. How can we be in 2020? And Nanja Moy is not deserving of health care, that Brian's role is not deserving of health care, and that Indian head is not deserving of health care. We have a job to do when we run for these offices. We're either going to ask people to settle for what we can get or fight like H.E. double hockey sticks for what they deserve. Healthcare and food are necessities. Plumbing is a necessity, right? I serve at the state, the Maryland Affordable Housing Trust. You know what we did? We passed the money that is working in Nanjimoy right now to fix their wills and indoor plumbing. We do that through Charles County DCHD. That was a vote. That was my that was my vote, and that was my voice. This has to happen. And here we are. Thank you. You didn't ask for all of that.

SPEAKER_03 16:10

No, no, no, but thank you for offering it. Thank you for offering it. I love it when it's just like free. If I don't have to pay for the stuff, I say I'll take all the free information you got. Because no, that sounds amazing. As uh kind of like narrowing it down on what you said though about the assessment through through through PJM, what are your thoughts on like how to make that work, especially when when we see now the the what it who is it? The um county administrator kind of has has regulation over like higher hire hiring and firing when it comes to who is the uh head of um PJM or uh PGM. What do you kind of kind of see as some of the barriers that you're gonna gonna face? And then also what is your plan to work around those um barriers? One of them could even be do you believe that the Board of Commissions should have to basically vote to approve who who is the head of these uh certain um departments as well.

SPEAKER_01 17:04

Absolutely, I do. Absolutely, the commission should have, in my opinion, the final say-so. How is it that the commission does not, but they are elected by the people in their district to represent them? Who better to tell us who to pull the level for, who to raise the hand for and say that's our person, but then the commissioner? Because the administrator's job is too broad really to hear from the community. I've never seen a poll from the administrator asking me my thoughts on an issue, right? So when does that happen? And in lieu of that, then the only other people who can speak on behalf of the people would be the people they elected, which would be their commissioner. Yes is my answer.

SPEAKER_03 17:46

Awesome, awesome.

SPEAKER_01 17:47

And I heard you say PG PMG a couple of times. I can't wait to get to that.

SPEAKER_03 17:51

Yes, yes, please. So what is your what is your view of of the current job of um PGM, given that not even or yes, yes, for housing, but also, hey, when it comes to uh businesses, they've they've had had issues when it comes to permits. And I'll tell you this, as as someone within Waldorf, even Waldorf residents are sick and tired of seeing the same type of businesses give permits as far as chicken spots, nail salons, and fish fries.

SPEAKER_01 18:18

They're the easiest to get, right? Here's what I've come to learn in my years of experience. The same developers that build your community are the same ones that bring in um those shopping centers and all of the like. But guess what? All of that stuff is done at the time a community is being developed. Those are the conversations that are supposed to be on the table. Okay, you're giving me a thousand-unit um uh community. I I think St. Charles is a very good example. St. Charles's should have its own everything because it's so big, right? And yes, the wise is there finally perfect. All of that is happening, right? So, to a certain degree, that's exactly how it should work. That all of those things are built in. When they are not built in in the beginning, then we're back at the place where you're gonna get what we can get you as opposed to what you fought for up front. But remember, I'm gonna keep saying it over and over and over again. The fight is with people who understand what you're fighting for. But most importantly, the fight is with the person who understands how to fight. When you don't understand the fight, then that's it. Because guess what I will tell you? There's really no fight with the developers. I love the developers and they love me because I'm 10 toes down on it. This is what it is. And honesty is what will get you to where you're going. But again, no business person is here to say, I want to do all of these things and I'm gonna spend hundreds of thousands of dollars out the kindness of my heart. No, good, strong conversation from both parties get us to where we need to be. That will always be the case, whether I win the election or not, this will always be how it's done.

SPEAKER_03 19:56

I would even say, even going on that, when you see or taking a step back, when you kind of see that, how the just expansion of homes within the county, you have an argument going on, should we have a four, should we build more affordable homes? Should we make what we have affordable? Blase blase, what you're really what we really hear too is a lot of people say, I'm tired of the building. I'm tired of seeing so many homes, homes built. Let's start building out the actual infrastructure first. Before we get down that conversation, I want to ask you, do you feel like developer or do you agree with the sentiment of that we need to to put a pause on the building? And also, do you feel as if developers have been taking advantage of the county and the not just type of building, but the excessiveness of their building?

SPEAKER_01 20:39

Let me tell you this. About five years ago, there was a meeting in Timonia, Maryland. All the developers are there. They made a decision about the county that they didn't want to build in anymore, but they were clear that Charles County is where the action was. Let's go build in Charles County. That's the reality of it. The density is here, it can be done. Let me also say this, and you can look this up. There are two factors that will run this United States, and it will run every state, it will run every county, it will run every municipality. It's real estate, right? For the United States, the top two tiers is real estate and big pharma. And your local jurisdictions, it's gonna always be real estate, right? So now we're talking about if real estate is it, how does it make sense? When I first got into this business, let's talk about affordable housing, right? It was truly affordable housing. Apartment homes couldn't just have street market rent. You could not. It was a federal law that at least I think it was like 30% had to be, you couldn't put them all in the same building. They had to be spread out so that you couldn't know, no discrimination. The fight went on, and that was that had changed. When it changed, that changed everything about affordability. The next thing that came down the line was tax credit, right? Tax credit. Tax credit is supposed to be the incentive that a county can or a state will provide a builder or a developer. Primarily, it works really good with apartments to incentivize them to make things affordable. Now I will tell you that tax credit is alive and well. The problem with tax credit is generally when laws go on the books and they're not the fresh new things, they're still there, can be used, but no one's using them. Why? I'm gonna tell you something. In the uh, well, earlier on in the 2000s, I pretty much managed uh most of uh the active adult communities. This was also a time where there was a terrible economic situation going on federally. And it was so bad that Social Security said, no one is getting an increase. No one. There were apartment communities that didn't understand that when they said that, you couldn't raise the rent on active adults. Now, mind you, I'm working for another company. But I, you know, been around, of course, you know, I work with um uh Delegate Benson, Senator Benson. So people know who I am. There were 70 and 80 year olds calling me crying because their rents were raised when Social Security didn't give them a raise. I have seen it all. But if no one is at the till making sure that those that are tax credits are being read properly, then this is what we'll have. So I say all of that to say Charles County is in a very unique position, that it has the opportunity, and I would say even now, because this is a this is an AOBA conversation, yes? AOBA is uh the the group that oversees builders. They're with the PMA. PMA is for apartment communities. These are real conversations to have. And both of them have to come to the table at this time. They both have to come to the table because builders are now doing some very smart things on their behalf. If everybody's paying attention, we have luxury townhomes now. So it's not just about building you a home and selling it and going away. They are becoming partners in the community. Well, who's governing that relationship? Who's asking them for what are you gonna do? Are any of these luxury townhomes affordable? When by the way, apartment community, I noticed that when we were going through the crash, your seven, eight hundred uh unit condominium turned into an apartment. Where are we on affordable housing over there? Real conversations. There is never a time, I believe, that there is not a good time for a conversation. Because guess what? Everybody wants to continue to build. So let's have the conversations down. Let's lay down the expectation for what the future looks like. Let's figure out what we can get you to come back and fix as we continue to have these conversations about other things. Uh, should building continue? No, that one I don't know. But I do know this. If it didn't, guess what? We're not gonna lose any sleep over it. And here's why. Because there's already a lot of housing. I think I I heard on another uh podcast from some conversation about those homes that have, for the most part, even more integrity than what's being built now, right? Those homes should be about the same amount, if not more, because they were built with different products, right? They were built to last and that's why they're still standing. A young family can certainly come in and buy that home and build out that home to what they need because what we call in the business the skeleton is good. But if that happened, Carlos, where would those active adults age out to? Where would they go? Where do they go? You have a Nanjimoy who is sitting on excellent real estate, beautiful homes. But if they age out, where do they go? They should have a right to live in Nanjamoy, right? So if you ask me, should we continue to build, I say, yeah. We should build what active adults need so that when they're ready to transition, so that a new family can come in into the home that has the good skeleton, has a place to go. I think there's room for all conversations. And I do believe that whatever is happening, it needs to happen sooner rather than later. So I believe that there should be a focus on build. But build has to come with infrastructure. But something's telling me that things are already happening. When I ride through Nanjamoy and I see brand new asphalt and trees falling down, only 30 years I've been doing it. And I'll say the question is what's going there? Is it affordable? When do we have the conversation?

SPEAKER_03 26:35

No, thank you for that. And I and it's a lot of Nanjemoy residents who are very scared, but also a lot of residents who aren't in Nanjamoy who who are scared because as we've seen already, Nanjamoy being right on the water, like it is, being kind of hidden away, can be a modern-day Ozarks. And a lot of people are scared because you have a lot of developers who are who are going in, buying a people's homes, or or even paying the property taxes that the family may owe, taking the home from the family, or going to people who may not know what their land is worth, offering them $50,000, them taking it, saying, I got a cash grab, but you may not realize your home and your property is worth five, six million dollars. So what kind of, and then also on adding on top of that, people not having indoor plumbing, electricity, people not having just like the modern function of society that we're that we're in now. What kind of protections do you support putting in place to protect Nanjemoy residents from from these home buyers or developers who are coming in trying to basically steal, steal their land from them?

SPEAKER_01 27:40

Um I've been talking about that out loud, as a matter of fact. The chair of um the Maryland Affordable Housing Trust is an attorney. She is amazing, nothing short of amazing. We were in one of the meetings and I was talking about the legacy land. What are we doing here, right? She said, Cheryl, the state has attorneys that they can call. We've got to get the messaging out. That there is free help for you to call to discuss it. But then there are laws that protect you from when someone pays your bills, that you have a period of time to which you can deal with finding the money to go back and get it, right? So we have to really find a way to provide the education that those folks in Nanjamoy deserve. I'm going to tell you that what I believe a lot of what happens is a lack of education. I think for me, I believe now as a candidate, I'm going to tell you that it is difficult for me as a candidate to find out all the things that I need to. Who do you have to be, right? Say what you want to say. People can say what they want to say. I have to be on Voices of Brian's Row, almost to figure out what to be on Charles County Matter and how. You know what I mean? That is not. It is, I am glad that those advocates are here and they are doing the work that you are doing, right? That together you all are determined to determine to feed us what we need to make good decisions. But that's the government's role. The government is responsible to make sure that we all understand what's going on. My hope is that the commissioners will have that real discussion, no matter who's at the table. If I'm elected, it's the thing that I'm talking about first. Like whatever we're doing, how do, how do we get it out? I'm not, I don't want to find out about a failed IG process, right? On a whim. Did that happen? Well, why you mean to tell me this whole time we hit, we didn't have any oversight? How do you how are we here with no oversight? Who thought that was a great idea, right? But when we don't know, we can't do anything about it. I'll go back and say what I said at the beginning. Before I'm a candidate, I'm a neighbor and a friend. This is why I'm running. Because this is kind of this is nonsense that we have to find out things from everybody other than the people we've elected to tell us. That's my social media.

SPEAKER_03 30:06

Social media plays a bigger role than the Facebook groups playing a bigger role than the government is as far as um communication. So, with that, too, kind of last question centered around housing for the moment is renters' rights. We see a lot of times people focus on homeowners, property owners, but don't really focus on the needs of renters who in Charles County really have very, very limited protections. You have have renters who are who are looking at their um um lease renewals go up $100, $200, $300 without any type of rent stabilization, any type of um control. You also see the fact that it's not just like private landlords, you also have full-on companies and uh and uh Wall Street speculators who are buying up entire neighborhoods, it's new neighborhoods that are being built, that it's only rental properties. It is no, and I'm talking about single family homes and townhomes as well. I want to ask you, do you support uh rent stabilization within Charles County? And then also what is your what is your mindset when it comes to what kind of system of rent stabilization you want to see?

SPEAKER_01 31:10

I'm gonna say that when I first started uh in in apartments, you could only go up 3%. That appeared to be enough for the landlord. I am not sure at when, rather, the bottom fell out to where you could do whatever you want. The same way that the government says that they're gonna regulate that when I drive my car, I gotta put a seatbelt on. They need to regulate that as well, right? That there has to be safety, not only when I drive my car, but safety when I'm making one of the most important purchases or rentals. When my housing is involved, I want you engaged, right? I want you engaged the same way you're engaged when you don't want kids smoking vapes. Get in it, okay? So, yes, I want I want to make sure that my nephew and my nieces, my children are homeowners, but I want to make sure that they are able to afford an apartment, right? I want to make sure that my grandchildren can afford to make an apartment. What are we asking? What are we talking about that's too much for one to comprehend and understand the necessity? What good is it if I'm gonna grow old here, but my children can't grow old here with me because they're priced out? Well, who's gonna take care of me? Where's my long-term health coming from? Because that's a whole nother issue, right? The expense of that. So I just I'm curious as to just why some things have changed, why we are still having conversations about people being safe, being able to live where they can afford to move the economy. Because you know, rent stabilization allows you to spend more in sprouts. Because if I got more money in my pocket, I'm going to the Macy's. Yes. If I got more money in my pocket, then I'm going to Silvadonna every uh Sunday morning. I'm gonna do it. Milk and honey, I'm on the way. Reservations make money in my pocket. Yes? That's all I'm saying.

SPEAKER_03 33:09

Wow. Thank you, thank you for that. That was that's actually been one of the easiest yeses to that question. Surprisingly, rent stabilization is something within this county, it's a back and forth, which I really don't understand, too, because when you look at it, a lot of renters are paying more than a lot of homeowners do in their mortgages. And so a lot of people need to start thinking of renters not just as, oh, you oh, okay, somebody paying $100 here. People are paying upwards of $2,000 in Waldorf, which crazy enough, Waldorf with no real public transportation, no way to get to your job that you need to get to to be able to pay for the for the um uh apartment is charging DC prices. All that $2,000.

SPEAKER_00 33:45

Who telling these troops today? Me or you, Carlos?

SPEAKER_03 33:48

Exactly. Honestly, both of us doing the job right now. So I love it. So as we kind of shift from housing into, I was gonna go to go to healthcare, but before that, I want to ask you about economic development because a lot of things really require right now, the whole state is in a deficit. We have Charles County worrying about where the money's gonna come from for this project, for that project. So we have people looking at putting stuff on hold. Um, I want to ask you, and also on top of that, you even look at the fact that within Charles County, about 80, 80% or around that of residents have to leave the county every single day to go to work, showing that we do not have a strong job market within the county. Our first employee or the highest employer is a school system which does not pay what they should be paying. So they're having a hard time even affording to live in the county. I want to ask you, what is your thoughts on the economic development and how do you expand on it to bring actual uh high-paying or just quality jobs here? Because I don't want to just say high-paying jobs, bringing stores that people want to go to within the county, shops that people want to do, so then people just don't have to go out the county every time they want to enjoy themselves as well.

SPEAKER_01 34:59

We're gonna spend some time here.

SPEAKER_03 35:01

Let's do it.

SPEAKER_01 35:03

So, the first thing that I'm gonna say is that I've done some reading, some financial updates just to kind of keep my finger on the pulse, right? They say that $100,000 will take you nowhere it took you just two years ago. What is a high-paying job? What is a livable wage? We've got to figure those things out. But in the meantime, while we're figuring it out, we know that we have to find partners. There is no county in the state of Maryland that is not successful because they don't have a corporate office of some sort. If it's a what is it, Gunthrum, Bay, BAE, Calvert Hasm? Why, why? Why is it that we do not have a corporate headquarters of some sort here in Charles County? Okay. We've got to figure that part out. But what can we do? What other something would give us the same effect? A hospital. Hospital needs employees 24 hours a day, seven days a week, right? We have Charles County Regional. We need a hospital. And we need a hospital on another side, on the western side of Maryland. We need it because that's instant jobs. That's nurses who can go to school right off of Lindon Town Road and get the education that they need to be a nurse, to be a phlebotomist. It's all there because I've been there, right? So we've now put in all the educational tools for us to stand up, a hospital, but we haven't. Why? When corporate um headquarters are a discussion in the state of Maryland, who's at the table on our behalf? Now, I've had my hands slapped, and I'm telling you right now, I'm a big thinker. I say to you, tell me how, don't tell me no. I understand the FBI is a big deal. Were we even in consideration for it? Well, where would it have gone? Sure, all the places you building houses. Because if you had that, you're gonna build more houses. The jobs are going to be more. So that's just an example of who is at the table for us in every single aspect, right? Today, it's about the opportunity to find commissioners that are knowledgeable and ready to deal with the real issues that are before us, right? There will come a time, which may even be now, now that I think about it, that we even think about who is going to Annapolis. I'm a neighbor and a friend. My taxes matter to me. My home matters to me. My representation and my absence matter to me. Who is at the table making sure that when these big deals come through the state of Maryland is on our end of the deal saying, hey, what about us? Yeah, we can make some things happen. Now I'm gonna stop right here because I want you to imagine something with me. Okay?

SPEAKER_03 37:43

I close my eyes for it.

SPEAKER_01 37:45

All right. So some years ago, there is a community called the Arts District of Hydesville. The Arts District of Hydesville is a live-work community. I was there from the dirt to its completion because that's what I do. I come in and I do that part. This was a conglomerate of everything made beautiful. We took a car dealership and turned it into a clubhouse. That's what happened there. We put condominiums on top of businesses to make sure that they could be sustained. We anchored that project with Bus Boys and Poets. Now imagine this. Here I go. The county has purchased the Sears building. Yes? The Sears Building is connected to a mall that we don't own. The talk about it is that it would be a great idea for it to be a sports and learning center. I love it. We all know sports and learning centers, as you go next door, there's a sports and learning center. For me, those are isolated. They generally come with a baseball field and all the things because it's sports and learning. Sports and learning. It should have a baseball field, a soccer field, bleachers, and the whole thing. That that is the concept of a sports and learning facility. Um, think what was described and what's being presented is more along the lines of an upscale gym, right? With a pool and a thing. But let's pause this and let's imagine that we took that same building. Now I'm gonna redevelop this whole area, right? I'm gonna redevelop the mall and I'm gonna include the AMC in it. Stay with me.

SPEAKER_02 39:20

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 39:21

We now have the Sears building. We're gonna take that Sears building and we're going to turn it into an entertainment zone. It's gonna have two floors of movie theaters. It's gonna have a bowling alley in there, it's gonna have an anchor restaurant in there. So if you come out, you're waiting, um, you can go in and have some ice cream, some chicken wings while you wait for your um your uh movie to come. And even more so in this movie theaters that we're gonna put into the Sears building that's gonna become our new event zone. It's gonna be the one where the chairs relax, we buzz and get the food to come to us. So we're gonna get comfortable, right? We're gonna own that mall and this imagination that I'm asking you to join me with. The bottom of it is gonna be commercial buildings around the bottom, and above it is gonna be condominiums. The condominiums are gonna be 30, 60, 90. That means that it's gonna be 30 affordable housing, um 60 adult, um, 90 fair market because it has to maintain itself. It's gonna anchor with uh, let's say the restaurant we anchor it with is going to be a Carolina kitchen. It could even be a Bus Boys and Poets. Around the parking lot, we're gonna drop in some um meters so that it can start paying for itself when people start visiting because now this is the place to live. This is it, this is happening, this is walkable, this is entertainment, this is living at a place that makes all the sense. It is encompassing of all types of lifestyle, right? Because we said affordable, we said fair market, we said active adults. It's all happening here. So, what are we gonna do with that AMC? We're gonna take the roof off of that AMC, we're gonna build out the inside of it and make our very own Martin's Cross wins. Why would we do such a thing? We would do it because we want someplace where the governor will come. We want the governor to come. We want a place where our county administrator can ask us to all join in this facility that we own and go over the budget with us in a place that we can rent, we can have graduations there, we can do a lot of things there, right? That's what we could do. Imagine if development started looking like that. It's not far-fetched. We don't own the whole mall. It's so. But imagine sitting down at the table and saying to Simon, what do you think about this? How does that feel for you? How do we collectively make that happen? I mean, we do still own the Sears building. How do we do that? How do we take the best of what you have right now and make it a walkable, livable space? How do we build it green so that it stays affordable for the people around it? I'm just thinking.

SPEAKER_03 42:05

No, no, definitely. Thank you. So is this so going down further into this vision that you uh propose, is this something that you would actually want to do as far as like stopping the the change of Sears from becoming a sports and learning center into an entertainment event and living mixed development complex?

SPEAKER_01 42:27

It is a conversation that should be had. And yes, it is the one that I will put on the table. The beautiful thing about where we are now, they've probably done some things on the inside, but not to the point where we can't have a conversation. I I would wonder what would the public say when they heard, Jesus, did she just reimagine that? When it just happened just down the street and around the corner? That this is really something that can happen. You go anywhere in this immediate Washington, D.C. and Virginia, and what I just described is in every single place. It's the new way to build. It is what it's about.

SPEAKER_03 43:02

Yeah. I mean, you even look at, I believe it's it's Howard County or Frederick County, one of them, they are they're actually buying an entire mall and saying we are turning this into an actual sustainable city. And I think that's one thing that has been shocking within Charles County that there was never even the conversation of, okay, what would it be like if we made a major investment into the county itself and bought the mall and the surrounding complex so that we can decide what the actual county looks like. We can create a urban center, because that is the one thing missing from Charles County, too, is an actual urban center. A lot of people talk about wanting light rail to come in. A lot of people also look at and say, what are light rail will mostly just send people out of the county? We need something to also bring people into the county as well so that we can benefit from it. I love that idea.

SPEAKER_00 43:48

You're feeling inspired.

SPEAKER_03 43:50

Yep.

SPEAKER_00 43:50

You're in my imagination.

SPEAKER_03 43:52

I love it. I love it. This it's a fun place right now. So I want to ask you I'm kind of kind of going into further, which Mentioned about the FBI building and the possibility that that could have had if it did if it did come here. I want to get your thoughts now because as we see with the current Trump um administration, relying on the federal government is becoming less and less reality. We see Doge, Doge kind of dismantled federal workers. Uh the FBI building is looking like it's not even gonna come to Greenbelt now. Um, do you have any hesitation on the reliance of the federal government when it comes to jobs, uh, whether it's uh having having a working relationship as far as like bringing contractors down and things of that nature as well?

SPEAKER_01 44:35

I'm not optimistic at all. At the United States, this is a very tough time. The reality is that there are, I understand, almost 600,000 women with no jobs. Now let's stop right there. Because what is factual is that women really, in many homes, are the breadwinners. If the decision was that we were not the right fit, because it can't be about education, right? It can't be about that. This is not even about black or white because women are affected. Maybe more some than others, but women have been affected. No, I I don't believe that that is the case. I don't, I don't want to uh say anything that I don't really believe in. I think that change happens. I think our change is going to happen at the state. Our change is to happen in the county, and the county has to demand it. And we demand it right now at election time. We demand it at election time. Sometimes the same old, same old. I was somewhere this weekend and they reiterated this. You can't continue to do the same thing and ask for a different result. It simply doesn't happen. And no one let me tell you something else, and I want you to make sure this makes the cut. I find it quite interesting when I listen to elected officials talk about the problems, and you've been sitting for eight years. Now come on now.

SPEAKER_03 45:56

Any specific ones you want to name?

SPEAKER_01 45:58

No, because they know who they are. I'm telling you, let me tell you something, Carlos. I have family throughout Charles County, so our success is important to me. But even if I didn't have family, my work makes Charles County important to me. It makes Montgomery County important to me because I sit on their commission. It makes Prince George's because I am a consultant for them. It makes Charles County because I sit on their homeowners resolution dispute board. All of this is important to me. I have real concerns with anyone who can have a conversation with me, the dreamer, right? Because I'm the dreamer. I'm the candidate, the dreamer. And tell me about the things that I'm discussing in a real way that needs to be changed. Where were you when I needed you last winter, Stevie Wanda? I had to throw that in. And so, yeah, that's the real question. I'm gonna say this to you because this is important to me too. For anyone who said that they aspired to be a commissioner, this is what I know. I knew I wanted to do it a year ago. I know I wanted to do it last year. Last summer, I knew for sure this is what I wanted to do. I'm gonna ask you, what have you done? When you're ready, I'm gonna roll out the list of the things that I've done as a candidate. I don't want to ask anyone for their vote based upon what I say I'm going to do when I sit down. I'm asking you for the vote because I'm already in it, doing the things that candidates should be doing. I have an issue with that. So let's just, let's just put it out on the table. What have you done? Because if you're an elected official, you should know how to maneuver these things. You know what all the deals are, the ways to, you know that, right? If you have been a politician in this county, you know everybody. When I show up, I see all the people talking to each other and oh, hey, how you talking? Yeah, and did is that, okay, so everybody knows everybody, right? Everybody knows everybody. Then why are we here? Who didn't fix it? Who didn't get together and say, I want us to go out and have tea next week? But by the way, I need you to make sure that this developer gets over here and get this matter fixed, okay? Okay, Cheryl. That's that is the expectation that I would have, but that's not the case. And if you want to run for District 2, I'm saying, okay. If you're on the western side of Maryland, I have every expectation that when you knew that this one day could be yours, you thought your way even outside of the base. Because let me tell you something. I don't even understand where this conversation comes from, that Charles County in Western Maryland, we have an obligation to work with the base and make sure the base gets whatever they need because they give us 8,000 jobs. I've been working in Washington, D.C., Maryland and Virginia for 30 years. I assure you, Andrews Air Force Base has a round table. They are required to sit down with Prince George's County every month to talk about the contributions that they're going to make to Prince George's County and how Prince George's County will then take into consideration the things that they need even off the base, right? So all of that real estate that you see around Andrews Air Force Base, that's not by happenstance. That's by the county taking charge and saying, we love you being here. This is just the best thing since sliced bread. But come on, sit down. Because there's some things that we need to get, right? We need that whole corridor to look like people are coming there to work, live, and play. How do we do that together? How do we do that together? Do you have a job for every level of person needing to be employed on the base? Do you? Are there programs to get everybody ready to work on the base? 8,000 jobs are coming. I can't wait to see the pilot program. I'm just a neighbor and a friend.

SPEAKER_03 49:44

Or even jobs.

SPEAKER_01 49:45

Everything that's out loud that everybody's thinking.

SPEAKER_03 49:48

Yeah. Wow. So, one last question on the economic development front, real quick, is that you see a lot of these kind of businesses, as we said before, saying a lot of the problem is the permitting process, how long it takes them from when I have my thought in my head of, hey, I want to open up a dessert restaurant into the actual day, it's time to open up the amount of red tape, the amount of like kind of only knowing about things behind closed doors and how we see certain certain businesses get favored in the permitting process than other businesses. It seems easier for these corporate chains to get permits than it is for your small mom and pop stores. I want to ask, what are some of the challenges that you see with the permitting process and how do you want to fix it? And then as a follow-up question, about uh where do you see the county working with unions?

SPEAKER_01 50:37

Businesses. Businesses is a um it's been an eye-opening experience for me as a candidate. There's a barber. Western Charles, Maryland, and for District 2, I just want to clarify for anybody who's listening, St. Charles Parkway, that part of um District 2, um, their matters are um very serious to me. I understand them. It's generally around the build itself. Um, those things, um, again, it's just what I do for 30 years. I know they're builders, so that makes it a little bit better. The western side of Charles County, I am almost shocked at some of the things that I've seen. I'm gonna give you an example. I got a barber who took his his, let's call him dreamers. I like that. Because people who go in to become entrepreneurs are dreamers first, right? This is something that I want to do. You're a dreamer. And look at what you did with the dream, yes? So these are the dreamers. He decided that he was going to open a barber shop and he found the right space. This is the right location. He did everything he needed to do to get it to where it should have passed. But then he was told that the electrical box was 45 years old. That had to be changed. He found out later that after they did the floors, they had to bust up all the floors he did because the plumbing under the floors needed to be dealt with. Let's start with the journey, the the dreamer's first issue, the county's first responsibility to the dreamer. The first thing you have to do is hold the landlord responsible. I don't care what anybody says. The landlord is responsible. There should be an inspector with the skill set that can go in and look at the box and say, you're not allowed to lease this to anybody until that box is switched out. We need to make sure this plum. And when the last time you did something with these plum, are these original pipes? You know what I mean? There has to be something that allows the dreamer to keep the funds that they saved up for the dream to use for the success. Yes, that is not the case. There is another few sisters that I know who had a business here in the Waldorf area. They put a air conditioning system on the roof for the landlord, and the landlord eventually took the place. What most people don't understand is the terminology and uh and the agreements with commercial space. And I believe that there should be some courses for dreamers to take here, excuse me, in county for a few reasons. One, you get a better understanding that you're looking for the word affix in a lease. Because once it is affixed, it belongs to the landlord, whether you're there or not. You don't get to take those things, yes? And so I think that the dreamer has a right to find a spot for their dream to happen, and the county had a responsibility to make sure that they weren't going to get hit with electric, plumbing, HVAC. That's just roofing. None of that thing is supposed to happen. Yes? Uh, I think that there is a responsibility for the county to make sure that there's some workshop so that other people from other counties say, I'm going over here because my business is going to be protected because they have all of these things in place to make sure I won't get hit with that, you know, up front. I'm gonna take this money and I'm gonna give it to the radio station, I'm gonna give it to social media, I'm gonna buy me some ads, and I'm gonna get my business off the ground. Yes. I think that um there is a responsibility for the dreamer to understand too. Um, so what I would say is that I am for business, but I am for smart growth everywhere around. It has to be smart, it has to have integrity, because this is easy stuff I'm talking about. This is easy. So I think that that's how I would feel about that. Did I answer that question? Because I get all passionate.

SPEAKER_03 54:26

No, you did. No, you did. You did a great job answering it. No, you know you did. Or I say before we move on to the next topic, real quick, is uh just a more simple question about what do you think, or what do you feel the role of um unions is when it comes to working with the county as far as bringing jobs, as far as making sure all these developments that we see see being built have a uh project labor um agreement attached to it as well.

SPEAKER_01 54:51

You're probably too young to remember this, but all the people in my generation, I'm gonna use the example of Claudine. That's a movie from a long time ago. Your parents will know Claudine. Ask them about it today. Uh, if it wasn't for the union job her fiance had, she would have never got off welfare. Claudine. I think for me, that was probably the first time in my life, and I was probably young. I won't even think I was a teenager, right? But I understood that as a young person watching it again. I'll give you another one with um Diana Ross and Billy D. Williams, and he was an advocate and she was a model. Gosh, I'm mad I can't remember the movie. But his fight was for the union. So, what do I say about the union? The union has been protecting folks and their jobs for as long as I've been living. And I've been on this earth for some years, and I'm not telling nobody my age. I may look young, but I've been around a minute. So for me, I'm with unions. Um, unions provide a protection against um a lot of things. Um, employers, big corporate industries that will to do whatever they want. So, yeah, I think that I support unions and I specially support them in the medical field. Nurses, doc, yes, yes to unions. And let me say this to you too, Carlo. Candidates received emails from unions asking, fill out this questionnaire because um, you know, if you want us to endorse you, I chose to do no endorsements. Not one. I'm here to tell you I'm not looking for any endorsements, and here's why. I'm a neighbor and a friend first. I am doing this because I'm qualified. I'm pro in my mind, my mind, I'm the most qualified person at this moment to do this job. That's one. Two, um, for me, the only endorsement I need is the vote the day that the election happened on June 23rd. Because if the people say yes, then I don't have to worry about trying to figure out how to make this person happy, that person happier. Well, we endorsed you. We, we, we gave you some money for your mailer. That's okay. I'm gonna just come and do the will of the people because I got a feeling both my will and theirs aligned. We're tired of the mess and we need somebody in there. Period. And I'm not one that's gonna get tired because I've probably been around politics, maybe even more than some of the people who've been sitting here. Because remember, I ran with delegate Joanne C. Benson. So I've been around it a long time. There's no move in me. I understand. And so that's what I would say about that.

SPEAKER_03 57:28

Go union. Awesome. Thank you. Thank you. I'm uh transition us to another conversation that a lot of people have been talking about within Charles County. It's actually coming up um uh June 1st as well, is data centers. Right now, you have a massive amount of residents, not just in Charles County, throughout the state, who have in the country who've been saying we do not want data centers. We don't want them here, we don't want them tomorrow, we don't want them yesterday, we don't want them next year, ever. Have um a record amount of residents showed up, uh, two to one to oppose a data data center, uh ZTA, which would allow permitting for data centers. You have the Board of County Commissioners who are who I hesitate to even say kind of discussed setting up a community, a community kind of task force to look at what are some of the um environmental and and uh health related impacts of data centers versus how how we can mitigate it and have some regulation. Even within the the voice of regulation, residents are saying we do not want data data centers. I want to ask you first is do you support data centers coming into the county and then why or why not?

SPEAKER_01 58:29

I'm gonna back into this and you're gonna you're gonna hear why. Before, well, I guess it was right after. I was on next door and um hearing people going on about the electric bill. Um I have to hear it in board of directors meetings. It's right, because if my electric is high, how am I gonna pay these assessments to? Like, something's gotta give. Okay. Pardon me. I understood that. That means for me as an executive in this industry, I better go study because I have to be able to have a knowledgeable understanding to have a basic conversation. First things first, why is our electric bill high? Go to your research. The electric bill is high because we share a grid with 13 states in Washington, D.C. The electric bill is high because Loudoun County is pulling 94% off the grid, and they have impact fees that will assist them so that they don't get hit as hard. Now, mind you, Loudoun County is one of the wealthiest counties in Virginia. That's a lot of money. That's where your redskins are, right? Your commanders, my bad. Uh, that's where they are, right? And so, yeah, they've set themselves up. There are 600 machines operating right now. They require lots of water. They require lots of electricity. Um, I think I read that now uh the Potomac River has gotten like an E or an F now. That the reality of this is far more serious. Well, I've done my homework and now it's time for me to figure out what we need to do because somebody better start talking about something that is effective and change. So I did what I do best, made a couple calls, figured out who was supposed to be in front of this, where do we go to get some answers, who is gonna fight this? Because we don't know as constituents what to do. So I wrote a letter to the office of the People's Council on Cheryl Butler for District 2, uh letter head. And while I vote I wrote it for District 2, it was really for all of Charles County because no other elected official wrote a letter. And to date, to my knowledge, is the governor is the only other one. The letter that I wrote made it into evidentiary on the 24th hearing against the utility companies. Now let me back up. The Office of the People's Council is the agency in the state that has one mandate, one mandate. Its job is to fight on behalf of homeowners and small businesses against utility companies. That's all they do. I wrote the letter, I got a response in writing that said, you get it and you're right. I came back and I said, okay, thank you. Now how do we fight? They said you got two choices, really. You can go to your attorney general and, you know, the attorney general only does class action suits, so it would have to be probably a class action to say, here is what we want. Because I asked for three things. I said the first thing is every single person in Charles County should be allowed to be on the budget payment plan no matter what. Currently, to get on a budget payment plan, your bill has to average out about $300 a month. I say, forget that. That is non-applicable to us right now because we wouldn't need this if we weren't paying for Loudoun County. That's one. Two, what are we going to do to make sure that we get our money back? How does this work? Who do we call? Because we shouldn't be paying for this. This means that we need someone on our behalf negotiating with Virginia to get some of their impact fees back to Charles County and Schmecka, right? Third thing, why are we now allowing PJM to auction, listen to me now, auction the utility instead of paying for it the way they have in the past. What does that even mean? How do you even auction, right? The highest bidder gets it, right? And so I say that to say my answer to data centers is there is much conversation to have. I will say to you that today, I can't imagine how. Two, let's just use our business brains now. Do we really need a data center? Or do we go get the money from the people who have a data center who took impact fees in the amounts of like 400 million? Do we go after them and get some money? Or do we put that poison in its initial state here? And the reason why I say that is with everything that we do in this world, it gets better with time. There will come a time where data centers will be green. They will function all on their own, right? It is the same that I would say to you that a new developer needs to come in and have a water certificate, or he can't build because we shouldn't be trying to figure out where you're getting your water from. We already know that the the water pressure in Anjamoy has been dropping up for decades to the point that they're thinking they're gonna have to drill down further. Well, you're gonna keep drilling down, and then what you gonna do when there's nothing? So we've got to hold people accountable a different way. So today I say to you, I'm not for data centers today because it hasn't properly evolved. When it can sustain itself, when it can build itself, then that makes sense. I'm gonna also say this because I've been going on about this for a minute, too. We had a forum, my very first one that I went to, I haven't been to another one, I don't think. And I asked the audience, I said, if your electric bill has gone up, raise your hand. Everybody raised their hand. This was a data center question. I said, that's the answer to the data center. If you want to know the effects of it, that's it. It's irrefutable. It's irrefutable. Will it use your water? It's irrefutable. Are there contaminants? It's irrefutable. The men who build those, they're bought in from someplace else. So the job farce is a farce. It's a farce. They come in because it's specialized equipment. They build it, they leave, and then they have maybe 50 people.

SPEAKER_03 1:04:46

If that many.

SPEAKER_01 1:04:47

If that many. So now we have this job thing that was supposed to be a job thing that's not really a job thing, but we have it. The people who work there have to wear specialized suits because it's so cold on the inside that they can't go in. But the people who live around it, they say that even when they're away for it, they still hear the noise.

SPEAKER_03 1:05:07

This is I would even say past that, you have a situation where the lifespan of the servers are only three to five years. So that means every three to five years, you're putting all of those harmful chemicals that are inside those servers into our landfill. So every time it rains, we have contaminated water, which goes goes to your uh your um point before about how Nanjamoy we're getting we're gonna keep drilling, drilling, and drilling until sometime we reach contaminated water from the lead and other toxins that are that are put into our uh soil.

SPEAKER_01 1:05:34

Let's run for district two together. We'll be the duel.

SPEAKER_03 1:05:37

That is all you. That is all you. I will sit here and be really good, the dynamic duel. I I will sit here and make my little commentary about my policy platform positions and let you do the running. Thank you for so so just just to kind of clarify it for the um people too. So you're saying as of right now, you are a no on data centers, but you are open to it in the future as long. As certain things are mitigated as far as like the climate, the health, the uh environmental impacts, the groundwater, the noise, and things like that.

SPEAKER_01 1:06:08

All of it. When it's 100% sustainable and green, listen, I'm saying let's have a conversation. I'm not saying how I feel about it then, because as I said in the room, oh, this is what I want to tell you. I was met with another candidate who said, if you have a cell phone, raise your hand. A cell phone has nothing to do with data centers. I want to be crystal clear. It has nothing to do with that. And I want everybody to know that the data centers that are in Loudoun County are international data centers. When this Iran Iran war, whatever we're in right now, this war, they were going after just those centers to try to shut down what was happening around us.

SPEAKER_03 1:06:43

So I mean, there's just we already got a got a weapons military base. We don't need any more targets to be put on our county.

SPEAKER_01 1:06:51

You said you're right.

SPEAKER_03 1:06:52

No, no, you're definitely right. And then even the palantir, hey, when it comes to surveilling the public, things like that, all the horrible things that a data center can use. One one real quick point I'll make that you kind of um um said said before is or said recently is I am so sick of people saying, Well, you use a laptop, will you use a cell phone, will you use you use uh a pager, then you're on a data center. My mindset is this okay, cool. Even if I give that to them, then we shouldn't need no new data centers because it's not like we created 20 million people since like two, two, three years ago. So fine, let's keep all the data centers we have now and not build a single more because they're already handling it. And even to your point about in the future, a lot of people are even looking in the future, all these big buildings are gonna be obsolete. And we can start running running data centers in like little small, small-scale buildings to where you're gonna have a bunch of people with just empty buildings that have created their whole government funding source around a data center and then come 10 years from now, they're scrounging around. Loudoun County could could become one of the poorest counties within the country if they just rely on data centers fully.

SPEAKER_01 1:07:58

They could.

SPEAKER_03 1:07:59

Yeah. So definitely.

SPEAKER_01 1:08:06

And we're neighbors to that.

SPEAKER_03 1:08:08

Yeah. And that's also I'm I'm glad to see certain counties or certain states looking at removing themselves from uh PJM. I even think honestly, actually, before we move off of data centers, one last last question about it is what are your thoughts on the TerraWolf um uh data center coming? PJM has even come out publicly and said they do not support TerraWolf buying up Morgantown Power Plant because they say we do not have the energy it would take to fund or to even even fulfill that type of center. But then on top of it, it too, Terra Wolf is talking about, oh, we'll bring our own energy source. I don't know a single resident who wants a data center right next to a natural gas plant or next to a a nuclear power power plant. What are your thoughts on that um development?

SPEAKER_01 1:08:51

My thoughts that I've heard the commissioners say that's not what we were told when we had the conversation.

SPEAKER_03 1:08:58

I need someone to explain that to me because I don't know where's the discrepancy of what they told you versus me.

SPEAKER_01 1:09:04

Because that's the answer.

SPEAKER_03 1:09:05

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:09:06

When we go to the I'll say it again. We can't, we must have people at the at the commission, at the table that have some expertise in something. When I tell when I work with my boards to get them together for an annual election, the question is do you have a CPA that's running? Because somebody needs to check management and the financing, right? Is there an attorney that is versed enough that they may run for the board? Because any operating board over business should make sure that certain things are covered. Who was the expert and who is the experts now? Because this is an expert state of emergency. Can you imagine having that conversation giving way to that? And then here, well, that's not what was that, that's not what that's not what they said. How does that happen? That's just, again, I just want everybody to know and and all of the commissions to know that this is not personal for me. This is me being a neighbor and a friend and a taxpayer paying 40% in recognition tax. If you took uh a few hundred dollars for me and now it's gonna cost me over $3,000 to refinance my home. I'm her. I'm her.

SPEAKER_03 1:10:16

And it's even insane when you mention how you have commissioners. And I'll just be honest here. You had Commissioner Amanda Stewart and I believe Commissioner Bowling um uh or Gilbert Bowling also within that um meeting or board, a commission meeting, mentioned how we heard one thing from the from Tara Wolf behind closed doors that like now it looks like it's different. It was even astonishing to me that one, none of the commissioners said, Well, let's call them back for a public meeting. So now we can put everything out on the table. You're gonna give the same presentation that you did before, and we're gonna say, why is X different that we heard privately than like X of what we're hearing publicly? And we see it was kind of this like, oh, we're upset that they did this, and then, all right, cool, we're not gonna talk to Terra Wolf anymore and say, explain yourself. So you're definitely right that we need more, we just need more accountability and more people who are willing to like go up front and say no, we're gonna actually start having these conversations out front in the open rather than just behind closed doors so that anyone can say, Oh, that's not what they told us. How do how do we know that? That you're not saying that because now politically it just looks bad on you.

SPEAKER_01 1:11:20

Add one thing to that. Please do. I want to know who the um environmentalist was that was there. Who was the attorney that specializes in this that was there? One of the things that we learn in my business early, we know our business and we stay in our lanes. When a board decides that they want to ask for an interpretation of their governing documents, when they ask for an opinion, we bring in the attorney. We're not opinion people. We stay in our lane. So the question is who was in the meeting that was an expert? Because I must believe that an expert would have caught what was being said to prevent anyone from hearing something different later. Who was in the room?

SPEAKER_03 1:12:01

Thank you. Yeah. And they need we need names, documentation, pictures, all of that. And then bring them here and then we can discuss on the podcast. I want to ask you um three last questions as we close out. One, one should be quick, quick, quick, because you kind of already kind of um touched on it, especially with with you not not taking um endorsements, is when it comes to how how campaigns are funded. We see that developers, we see real estate lobby, we see just all unions, all different groups, even groups that lobby the county government, like uh G.S. Procter and associates, who famously gives money to candidates, lobbies the county for different uh private uh businesses and people, and then on top of that, the county even hires them to lobby for the county to Annapolis, all to me sounding like a revolving door. I want to ask you, are you taking any money from developers, corporate PACs, lobbying firms? Why or why not?

SPEAKER_01 1:12:57

And I am not because I don't have to. I don't, I don't, I don't have to go down that road, right? I want to say to you this about lobbyists. They're another business that is gonna come out and petition people to be in business. Nothing in our life happens without lobbyists when it comes down to the things that we need. Healthcare, there are lobbyists for it. Grocery stores, there are lobbyists for it, right? So lobbyists are, in my opinion, they're not the poison pill. The poison pill are the people who can be bought by them. That's the poison pill. While we're on the the subject of that, there's a lot of conversation about a commissioner should, we want a commissioner that's going to be full-time. The commission pays roughly, I think, $50,000 or a little bit more. That is not a livable wage. I want to be crystal clear that I'm never going to not work. It protects me, it protects the voter, because I'm not depending on $50,000 than a necessary conversation with a lobbyist, a builder, or anyone else because I don't have the funds on my own to sustain my life, right? I am not triggered by the carrots in the room. I take my family and we travel because that's what we can do. Yes? This is what my life is before I run. For me, someone very wise said this: never vote for a person who is not working in a political position where there is really no money involved. $50,000 is not money. Once it's taxed, right now you're only getting $35. What is that person going to do? This whole business about, well, I'm retired, I've got time. You may have time, but do you have the qualified education, experience, and knowledge for this moment? For this moment. So I say to Charles County, if you want a full-time person sitting in the commission, then I would suggest we rethink what a full-time person would need to do this job without breaking the rules.

SPEAKER_03 1:15:11

Would you support?

SPEAKER_01 1:15:12

I'm of the mass. I'm sorry.

SPEAKER_03 1:15:14

Would you support even setting up a task force of residents, however the government does, to look at creating a pay for commissioners so that it is a full-time, and I would say even a full-time without without allowing commissioners to have other jobs at the same time. Because one thing that I've been kind of skeptical on is that the fact that we do have part-time commissioners, because one, people's problems are not part-time within the county. And two, if it's part-time, you start to see, or as you see now. I mean, Commissioner Patterson, Commissioner Stewart at one point was having problems even getting to meetings because they they're working a full-time job as well.

SPEAKER_01 1:15:52

Yeah. Listen, let's just let's just talk about Annapolis. That's a part-time job for three months. They're paid a part-time wage for three months. Their issues are bigger than Charles County issues because it expands a state of everybody's issues. They have three months to make that happen. Charles County has to make a decision if they want to pay full time on top of all of the other things that we now have to pay for that just happened. The lawsuit has to be paid for. And if any other victims come out of that, they have to be paid as well, right? This is on top of the increases that we already have taken on. I've talked about the 40%. Are we up for that? Do we have it? Is this the climate for it? But it doesn't mean that just because a person has a full-time job that they can't do this. I would surmise that if the county did not want to put a pay for full-time, they think about a qualified staff. Because the commission really needs, if it has part-time commissioners, someone that is knowledgeable and working full-time to make sure nothing is eclipsed, right? So I think that there's a way to get that done. I would be open to your suggestion, but I'm just really nervous about where we are economically, with no one knowing if they're gonna be working or not. Because believe it or not, I'm in private industry. That doesn't, I'm in private industry and my career is one that I can say is a career. I can work anywhere in the world. I have to do two things, learn another language and their laws, and I'm in business. It's as simple as that, because that is what I chose. But it doesn't mean that I'm going to be employed because my company could downsize. It has shocked me. I this, I don't believe that's the case, but it could happen. And so for me, I think before I could support more funding for commissioners, two things have to happen. We all got to show up. Whoever's in there, you get first, you're gonna show me that you're gonna do some of the things you said. You're gonna accomplish something before we start talking about how to make you full-time at a real salary, right? I need to see that because technically you ran for a volunteer position, perform. Because you could have just done none of it, you could have not run and just been an advocate, right? But you didn't. You ran, some of you weren't even advocates. And so for me, I just think that right now, this is a show up so we can see it. Okay.

unknown 1:18:25

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:18:26

Awesome. And then, last two questions. One is what are your thoughts given all the different problems that you said the county is still facing from housing, businesses, Nanjimoy, water, healthcare. I mean, the list, the list is longer than than three podcasts put together. How do you feel that the current commissioner, Commissioner Thomas Cena Coates, has done, given that these are the same problems, a lot of problems that you're talking about, and she's been in office for eight years now?

SPEAKER_01 1:18:50

You know I answered that about the eight-year people.

SPEAKER_03 1:18:52

Yeah, I I wanted to single it in on just the person who you'd be replacing, I guess, technically.

SPEAKER_01 1:18:58

Now, let me say this. When I caught wind of what was happening in Nanjamoy, I spoke to two people. I spoke to Thomas Cena and I spoke to Edith Patterson. What I shared with them about the plumbing poverty program that was to help uh Nanjamoy, I was the first person to share that with them. I'll tell you something else, because I think this is important about the question that you ask. There's a bill called the Housing Uncertainty Act. Write that down, Carlos. You're gonna need that. Housing Uncertainty Act. I'm gonna summarize what it says. It says that the law from the state for all the land in Maryland says that if a developer comes to your county and they complete a substantially completed application, you have roughly 15 days to tell them yes or no. And if you don't, what they ask for is what they're gonna get. And if they build it 20 years from now, you're not saying anything. It is what it is, because you have 15 days to make that your feelings, what you want to have happen, happen. That's what it says. I asked that question. I put it out there. Does anybody know what is the plan, right? Because we're talking about failures in the building universe. Then we have to be aware of that because somebody has to be ready to look at these applications, come October 1 of 2026 and have 15 days to know what they're talking about, know what they're reading, know what the criteria is, because that work has to happen now. This is what it requires to build in Charles County, starting now. This is the checklist. So when you come in your 15 days with easy breezy going through it, here are all the things. Did you meet it? How do I feel about who is here before me? I feel that there is no hospital on the western side of Charles County. I think it's awful. I think it is apparent that there is no grocer in Nanjamoy. I understand that there is a food provider in Indian Head. The bodega is here. If you live in New York, you know what a bodega is. It's here. I appreciate that because that was a step in the right direction. There are three things we all need in our life. We need a roof over our head to protect us from the elements. We need food to sustain us, to give us life, and we need medical assistance and assurances for when we fall ill. There is no real reason for why those things have not been covered. And I'ma also say this: this is not just about Thomas Cena, because Thomas Cena could have put this on a table, but it took a majority to make it happen. And if the majority didn't see that there was a deficit in the county in certain areas, that's a bigger problem for me than anything else. That's not a one-person failure, that's a commission failure. And I'm gonna give you one more failure that pisses me off. Look at me, oh, here I go. There is a tobacco store on Inner Town Road. And that tobacco store, one day, I'm riding past. I think I was on my way to madness because I'm a madness generation kind of girl. I wear it, I got the hat. I understand madness the same way I understand Chuck R-E, like I get it. This this is this is my generation. So I'm on my way over to pick up my things from Madness. And while I'm at the light and flashing lights, it says buy urine here. And under that red sign and lights and a handwritten note, it said, Bow with a smile. That is a failure that that would even be allowed. You know what I did? First, I went bananas. I went ballistic because nothing like that should happen. That commissioners, you ride your district, right? The same way we ride con our HOAs and condos to see what's going on. You ride your district and know what is going on. That's not even my district. But I had family on that side. Have two grandchildren being raised on that side. It is walking distance to a middle school. Are you kidding me? I called the president of the organization that I'm with, NCBW, and I told her about it. She made the appropriate calls. And that commissioner kicked it in the tail. Because I'm gonna give her the credit where credit is, she kicked it in the tail. She called the health department, sheriff department, got everybody on the line and said that has got to stop. But that should have never been. I'm gonna tell you one other thing. As far as I'm concerned, it is those, any I I believe that the 40% recordation tax should not have been a tax on um constituents. You know why I don't believe that? Because these tobacco places and medical marijuana places, do you know they do well over a million dollars a quarter? Are you kidding me? First of all, I don't even understand how that wasn't even a thing because if you think about it, they sat this is where some people's vices are. Are they, they can be positive medically, but sometimes they do a lot of damage too. What is their buy-in? So the question that I have is what tutorial program have they put together and gave money for?

SPEAKER_03 1:23:57

And what are you talking about as far as like the I know that the uh marijuana businesses that their tax money is supposed to be taken by the state and then give a portion of it is sectioned off to go towards programs and things of that nature. I believe the alcohol businesses are are too, but I do get your uh overall point of like if they're just coming into the county, I would say more on the alcohol businesses than than personally the marijuana businesses for me personally, but for even even the alcohol businesses, what there seems to be a flood of them in, I would say this, in black communities specifically. To say, like, hey, we're gonna put these in your community because y'all like to drink, get some drink, and then we're just gonna make a whole boat boatload of uh of money on on you all. So yeah, no, I definitely get your point.

SPEAKER_01 1:24:42

All I'm saying is that for all of them, I want them to be better stewards in a county. Yes? Can you imagine that it probably will take a few thousand dollars to align with a nonprofit to have an after-school reading literacy program? They can put their money together and do an entrepreneurial program for young people on how to run a business. The importance of opening up a bank account and putting your money in. Whether they give to the state, I have no business with that. The state has made that a requirement for them. The question is for every business, what is your partnership to the county? What can we what can we ask of you to get us where we're going? We know our education system in Charles County is not measuring up. We have a deficit of special needs teachers. And yet we see mental health is a real issue right now. I wonder where all of the partners are. Just where all the partners are. And who's asking the partners to show up?

SPEAKER_03 1:25:42

No, you're right. Thank you. You're right. And then last question, which I'll say this, you're doing great answering the questions, even before I have them. But last question for you is you get elected. What are the first two bills that you want to sponsor?

SPEAKER_01 1:25:56

I want to IG. I want to IG, and I want the IG to remove the commission from having the final say on their decision to take action or remove someone. Because if I re if I read the current proposition for the IG, it came right down to the commission having to review what the IG said before it could actually happen. I would propose that again and make it the true independent party that it is supposed to be. So that that is number one, number one, number one. Number two, number two is equity. I really want to talk about equity. I want to talk about equity in terms of the entire county. I live closer to the Waldorf side. I'm the traffic, the load-in on Waldorf. I get it. Waldorf is supposed to be the mecca here. We, I think we have really overloaded. Um, I think that we need to really look at how we enhance other parts of the county. I think there is space, room, and opportunity on the Western side for real consideration. Because I tell you, I don't know how in the world we could have approved an airport before a hospital. Who does that? We have an airport before a hospital. I just, come on, District 2.

SPEAKER_03 1:27:16

Which I don't see a single person. We can do it. Actual person benefiting from that airport other than the owners of the airport and the millionaires who come in on these small private planes and private jets to go to the MGM casino, have their day, and then fly back. But that's that's my own tangent that I have for it. And the left view of the thing.

SPEAKER_01 1:27:36

I want to see that deal. Because if we said yes to an airport, what did they say yes to? That's gonna always be the question. If we said yes, what did they say yes to?

SPEAKER_03 1:27:48

Cheryl Butler Walker. Ta-da! Thank you, thank you so much. This has been an amazing conversation, enlightening, thought-provoking. I have thoroughly enjoyed it. And I want to say, can you please tell all the viewers how they can stay involved with you, your campaign, what's going on, get updates, and any final things you want to say to the viewers here today.

SPEAKER_01 1:28:11

I want to say to everyone, please do not take my word on me. Do your homework, visit my um website, it has everything there, which is vote shirle butlerwalker.com. I want you to, if you know Senator Joanne C. Benson, call her, ask her. If you know Delegate Donna Fennell, call her, ask her. I want you to take your time and make sure that what I've said to you is true and accurate. If you know folks who live in HOAs that I've managed, ask them. I am true to what I do. I am hopeful that I have already, through actions that I've taken, shown you that I will do the hard work of moving us forward. And as always, I have a number. So if you need to call me, please do so at 301-675-2101. That's 301-67521. You can reach me on all social media handles at Shirle for Charles County, Carlos Childs. This has been an honor. It's been a privilege. I love who you are. I love that you look like me. We're twinning. Um, I am proud of you, and I want you to keep doing what you're doing. And whether I get in this seat or not, me and you are going to be on this channel doing it carefree, foot loose, and fancy-free. Thank you, sir.

SPEAKER_03 1:29:43

Ooh, that was that that's a way to close it out. I love it. And definitely, you are invited back anytime at all. I would love to have even a deeper dive conversation into HOA management, how that's going, storm water management, all the crazy things, things that happen. But for all of our viewers, I want to thank you. Thank you so much for tuning into the podcast today. Remember, like, share, subscribe, hit all those little buttons, doodads, little trinkets, all the little pop up things that come up to keep this channel running as you all have been doing. And remember, please hit that notification button so that you can get alerted every time we drop a new episode right here on the left handed leftist. And I'll see you next time.